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lyon&healy chicago concert grand??

  • Unknown
    Unknown User

    I want to buy a concert grand harp. Since L&H announces the Chicago Concert Grand Extended, it is affordable for me. Although my dream pedal harp is 85CG, it is over budget!

    There is few information about the Chicago CG Extended. Any one tried it? How about its sound?  Thank you very much.

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    replies to "lyon&healy chicago concert grand??"
    • Barbara
      Barbara Low

      I tried one last week. Didn't spend much time with it, but I thought it was a good sounding harp, given the fact that it was still very new. Pedals were stiff, but those can be adjusted.

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    • o.
      o. t.

      Lyon Healy has a bounty program for Chicago line, right? Ask them about it. If you get a Chicago CG now and trade in within 5 years, you get a refund. If they give you almost 100% refund, then it'll be really worth getting. I mean right now it's new and people can't say much about it yet. But in 5 years, the sound should improve. By then, you will likely have tried out all those other models yourself. So, you'll know whether to keep it or to trade it in.

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    • Carl
      Carl Swanson

      I'm only guessing on this, but because of the super low price for a pedal harp, I'm guessing that these harps(the Chicago line) are the first harps to be built completely in Lyon & Healy's China factory.

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    • Jerusha
      Jerusha Amado

      <<are the first harps to be built completely in Lyon & Healy's China factory>>

      This isn't good news.  I would not even consider buying a harp in this line if this were the case, primarily because of the unfair trade practices that the Chinese utilize, as well as their abysmal record in the area of quality control.  I buy American goods whenever I can, regardless of the upcharge.

      Jerusha

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    • Andy
      Andy B

      A good friend of mine called and asked them about this, and was told by Lyon & Healy that they do manufacture them in the US at their Chicago factory.

      Andy

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    • Carl
      Carl Swanson

      Maybe the next time someone takes a tour through the L & H factory they can look to see if The parts for this particular line are being made there. It's the price that is the red flag. It's just not possible to make a pedal harp at those prices in the United States. At the very least, the action(which is the most expensive part of a pedal harp) is probably being made entirely in China.

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    • Tula
      Tula Ruggiero

      Would that mean that the Venus harp parts are made in China also? I ask because they have many harps in the same price range but their site says they are all American made. I never thought to not believe that. It would be very interesting to know.

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    • Kathy
      Kathy Chanik

      I tried a CG one of these at Somerset festival last week.  The saleslady there pointed out that the action plate says "Chicago BY Lyon and Healy", and implied that this meant some kind of different manufacturing process.  I couldn't quite pin it down from her, but she inferred some sort of imported parts or something.  It was kind of strange.  The harp sounded a little thin and tight to me, and that was the biggest model.

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    • Jerusha
      Jerusha Amado

      I don't know who can get to the bottom of this, but someone should.  The buying public has a right to know whether some of L H's mechanical parts are being outsourced.

      Jerusha

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    • o.
      o. t.

      What about Venus harps? Aren't they in the same price range? Does anyone know about Venus? I thought they were made in U.S... I mean if Venus can sell harps at that price range with all parts made in U.S., then LH should be able to do the same, right?

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    • Barbara
      Barbara Brundage

      The saleslady there pointed out that the action plate says "Chicago BY Lyon and Healy",


      Yes, I find it–um,suggestive–that the brochure says it was "designed" in Chicago by Lyon & Healy.

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    • Brook
      Brook Boddie

      I'm the one that Andy's referring to who asked L&H directly about this.  The Chicago line, just like all of their harps, are made at their factory in Chicago, IL.  They actually used the "Chicago by Lyon and Healy" phrase to reinforce this--that they design and make this line of harps along with all the others. 

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    • Jerusha
      Jerusha Amado

      Hi Brook!

      Did you happen to ask them if they are using imported parts for the Chicago line?  It's possible that Land H may be importing parts and then assembling everything at their Chicago plant.

      Jer

      (P.S.  I sent a message to you at your aol email address.)

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    • Brook
      Brook Boddie

      Hi Jer!

      I did not actually ask that question, so I can't say for sure that they are building everything from scratch at their factory.  But I do know the harps themselves area built and assembled there. 

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    • Denise
      Denise Krasicki

      What is there to know about VENUS and why are we being pulled into a discussion about L&H and their harps and prices. 

      VENUS :  owned by the same family who created the company 40 years ago, then and now makes each and every harp in their Chicago  facility from start to finish, utilizing  American made/grown raw resources/products and companies. There are enough VENUS owners here on the forum plus those that have been to our Factory at one time or another that all know there is nothing mysterious about VENUS. We are what we advertise 100% manufactured and assembled in our Chicago Factory in the USA.   

      Prices:  VENUS is owned and operated by the  family members as a small  manufacturing company, vs. L&H MEGA sized multi faceted Corporation.  Why are we less in price than them, simple,  a) size and the financial demands of a company of each size ie., small vs. very large,  b) basic economics of supply and demand. ( the generally observed relationship between demand, supply, and prices: as demand increases the price goes up which attracts new suppliers who increase the supply (theorhetically) bringing the price back to normal.

      If you have questions about their products, where and how they are made and manufactured, assembled etc and why they charge what they do, you should go to the source and ask them directly what it is you want to know.   Also,  might be good to investigate federal law as it applies to Amercian companies that outsource for their products.  What constitutes Made in America, the whole item and all its components, part or very little, that could be the key to your questions.

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    • Maria
      Maria Myers

      Lots of people go off on tangents on these threads--nothing new here.  It sounds like Oshiya is supportive of Venus harps, so I'm not sure why you're complaining about her post.  I wouldn't worry about it.

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    • harp
      harp guy

      I agree. I don't think that it was a post that was necessarily saying anything about Venus harps, but rather challenging what had been said about Lyon and Healy. I mean, if one company can produce a quality, all American-made instrument at decent prices, why should another company have to outsource in order to do the same?

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    • Denise
      Denise Krasicki

      Who's complaining Maria... she asked what and why about VENUS so I provided a very compressed explanation.  Same with the discussion on L&H, which was part of my reply its silly to compare the costs involved and prices of the 2 companies when they are  huge and ours is small - very different dynamics when it comes to everything we do as far as building harps from ordering materials to where and how we spend profit margins and why one company has a much higher margin than the other which effects overall costs.  That is the crux of the difference if you sit down and think it through.  We make a number of models that are are almost identical , ours are less, why ?..   how can we afford to do everything here, buy everything here and pay workers current USA standard wages here and cost less ?  Its very simple our size and all we do is make, repair and sell harps.  That does not make one product superior or inferior it just makes it more or less expensive because of the focus and priority of the two companies.    I do not see where any of that information is offensive, complaining or anything other than informational and I have as much right to respond as anyone else, especially from the point of being the HARP MARKER who is part of the discussion and questions were asked to which I replied with specifies as best as I could.

      What does L&H make here, in Italy in China, in Germany, Mexico etc etc.. who knows the best .. they do.  There are posts here from years back when that question was posed and one of their marketing people replied to it noting some parts are made in various countries (including those I just mentioend) and then sent to Italy or USA for assembly.  That was then, this is now, the variables could have changed a lot since then.  That is why I commented ,  the key is knowing what Federal Law is regarding using the statement "made in America" on your label and in advertising.  Since we do it all here in the USA its has no bearing on us, but, for other companies that utilitze markets elsewhere for components it would all depend on the law and how they can apply to advertising.   Right now China is the largest exporter worldwide for products that they make wholly there and then export for sale worldwide as well as being a jobber for American and other companies where some or all of the components for various items are made there and then exported for assembly elsewhere, usually the country of orign of the Corporation.  If you want a cheaper labor market then you must go offshore there is no mystery in that fact nor that a vast majority of large USA Corporations utilize the cheaper labor Markets in China and around Asia to keep their costs down and keep their profit margins up.   

      For us it would make no sense we are a custom house so we need to do what we do at home, in our own facility and completely under our supervision and control on a day to day basis.    What L&H does is what they do be it here or elsewhere.    Bottom line is the consumer who will make the ultimate decision based on their own personal specific criteria when it comes to buying, to those buying a "name" nothing else matters, to those wanting other aspects as their key issues for buying they will sort it out based on the information they gather, be they buying harps, cars, clothings etc - one's own personal criteria should be and usually is the deciding factor.

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    • Maria
      Maria Myers

      Oshiya brought up Venus, and you said this.. " why are we being pulled into a discussion about L&H and their harps and prices".  There was an implied complaint about her comments, which I thought was dumb because she doesn't seem antagonistic about your company.  You seem to be a very defensive person, based on this thread and previous ones. Why look for trouble where none exists?

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    • Tula
      Tula Ruggiero

      If you'll notice, I was actually the first person to ask the question about Venus being built in the US but being less expensive. I am glad to receive an answer, but resent being called "silly" for asking. I am a professional performer and teacher. I must regularly advise students and their parents on the harp buying process (mostly lever harps but sometimes pedal as well). It certainly does make a difference on the consumer end how much harp models cost, and people want to make sure they are getting a quality instrument when spending thousands. It is unrealistic to assume that people who have nothing to do with the business end of these companies are going to automatically know how they determine their profit margins. I have been impressed with the quality of Venus harps each time I have tried one or heard one. I believe they are comparable instruments to the other major brands available here. These kind of reactionary posts, however, concern me.

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